Attorney General opts for more modest state seal
Amazing things happen in Virginia. Absolutely amazing!
And while I was browsing through the comments about this little fiasco,I found a new interpretation for the Civil War...it's known in some parts of the South as The War to Prevent Southern Independence.
Get over it! You lost and it was 145 years ago...the world has moved on.
What, Virginia has a state surplus so huge that it can waste taxpayer money on nonsense like this?
ReplyDeleteI left the following in response to "War for Southern Independence" guy:
Just to be sure that I understand your point, you're talking about the liberty of Virginia's white people, right? Because at the time of the WPSI, almost all black Virginians were, of course, slaves, and by definition not at liberty. I appreciate that each slave was actually 3/5's of a white person, but multiplied out that still must make for around 300,000 Virginians who didn't give a damn about Lady Virtus and who cheered on "Virginia's crushing defeat." Correct?
Well said! Well said, indeed!
ReplyDeleteThe Attorney General should stay away from art museums. He would die of embarrassment and indignation.
ReplyDeleteFunny, when you look at him, he appears to be normal. I wonder what went wrong with him? Poor guy; he's doomed to be offended in some way for the rest of his life.
ReplyDeleteOh, boy, wait until you read the reply I drew:
ReplyDeleteCitizen K-
Ho hum…anything in defense of Virginia in the War to Prevent Southern Independence must conjure the old defense of slavery pablum. I look forward to the not too distant day when people who offer that tired excuse for the crime perpetrated on ALL Southerners, white and black, will be embarrassed by comments such as yours. Why? Because they reveal their childish understanding of our history and of what the Lincoln governments actions meant for liberty FOR ALL OF US ever since. You don’t even know that the reason slaves were only counted as 3/5 of a person was because NEW ENGLAND didn’t want them counted as people at all!!! It was the South that insisted that their humanity be recognized!!! I’d ask you to explain why the struggle for independence in 1776 was a glorious cause, even though all 13 colonies had slaves at the time (England had outlawed slavery by then), and the struggle for independence in 1861 was evil….but I know that would be far too difficult for someone who views the past by what they were taught by the victors…rather than the victims. Pitiful!!
I replied:
It just hit me: This is a joke and I’ve been punked! Good job: You got me!
But just in case I wasn’t punked, would you mind explaining how a war that freed slaves was a crime perpetrated *against* them? I can’t wait to hear this one.
Stay tuned for more!
I thought you had it right when you said you were being punked. It made sense. The reply was startling in as much as the writer has made such a weird hash of history. There is a lot more to that 3/5ths of person story. He conveniently leaves it out of course.
ReplyDeleteI have to go back and watch for the reply...it has to be good.
I wonder if the War to Prevent Southern Independence has a website? I must Google!
I searched and the first hit for that name brought up the LewRockwell dot com libertarian wingnut site. I should have known! You don't want to waste your time with them...
ReplyDeleteThe man who created that name...
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_DiLorenzo
I knew this couldn't help but get better:
ReplyDeleteCitizen K- glad you asked. It requires a bit more thinking but I’ll make the attempt anyway, but first let me remind you that Lincoln himself said that the war was for no other purpose than to coerce the Southern States back into “the union”. Uh, there goes the idea that we are a union made up voluntarily. Have you ever heard of the Corwin Amendment that Lincoln said he supported? Nah, didn’t think so.
Have you ever read about how “freed” slaves were treated by Sherman’s “bummers” in Georgia? How about how this “contraband” were FORCED into the Federal armies or left to starve. How about the laws in the North that would not allow an African American to settle in their state. Check out what happened to such an emigrant in Mr. Lincoln’s own State of Illinois should he stay longer than two weeks.
THINK about the consequences of taking millions of people that have not had any training or preparation to support themselves and their families in a free society and suddenly, violently thrusting them out into a larger, now hostile and embittered society, and then leaving them alone to, as Lincoln once said of them, “to root hog or die”.
A century of grinding poverty and strained race relations was the legacy you celebrate. If YOU READ and STUDY our history, you will see that hundreds of thousands of former slaves were being freed by the South AND were preparing these people through training and even being set up with land of their own. Southern leaders KNEW that this was the BEST way to eventually end slavery peacefully. This is how it was done throughout the Western World, except in two places… Haiti and the United States. Do you know how it went in Haiti? The slaves rose up and killed ALL of the French people and even those of mixed race! The Southern people were well aware of this and yet this is exactly what the abolitionists of the North WERE ENCOURAGING!! Have you ever read anything of Hinton Helper? Nah, didn’t think so. Hey, I could go on and on but then you’d have a book. Try reading some on the subjects you presume to offer your “wisdom”. You might start with Eugene Genovese’ “Roll Jordan Roll”, or Fogel and Engermans’ “Time On The Cross”. Mr. Lincoln’s War didn’t end slavery, it merely enlarged the plantation to include us all. Case in point, find out what has happened to those who resist government conscription or what happens if you fail to pay your tribute, er, I mean property tax sometime. They WILL come for “your” property and take it away from you…and if you resist…they will KILL YOU. Still think YOU are free?
Steven, I really have to thank you for pointing me to this guy. Serious or not, he's a lot of fun. Here's my reply:
ReplyDeleteW—mind if I call you W; it seems to fit—I haven’t heard the old “the slaves weren’t ready for freedom and they really had it pretty good on the plantations” argument since junior high in Texas back in the 60s. Thanks for the memories.
No, I haven’t read any crank apologists for slavery, nor am I likely to waste my time on them. I have read Bruce Catton, Shelby Foote, and James McPherson on the WPSI and the run-up to it; David Herbert Donald on Lincoln; Stephen Budiansky, Richard Nelson Current, and Nicholas Lemann on Reconstruction; C. Vann Woodward on Jim Crow; and Taylor Branch on Jim Crow and the Civil Rights movement.
Anyway, you have quite a riff going, and I’ve just got to keep the mike open. So let me take a stab at the official WPSI narrative:
Incredibly, after its brutal victory in the WPSI, the north proved even more oppressive by installing corrupt carpetbagger regimes that combined with freed slaves to deny power to ex-Confederates, none of whom would dream of harming a flea until provoked by the Republicans and the Bad Negroes.
Essentially, there were Good Negroes (by far the majority) who knew their place and had no interest in such notions as political equality, economic opportunity, and education. They were only too happy to be led by their former owners who had always had their best interests in mind.
The Bad Negroes, while few, were another matter; they and their carpetbagger allies had to be pulled up root and branch, violently if necessary. Violence, although extremely regrettable, was of course justified by the ever present threat of a horde of Bad Negroes—always hinted at but never seen—killing white men and forcibly marrying white women.
The heroic ex-Confeds prevailed with the help of a vitriolic press and a political establishment led by the likes of L. Q. C. Lamar. A completely justifiable reign of white terror drove out the carpetbaggers and killed or subdued the ever-present danger of the Bad Negroes.
The white South then instituted a completely humane and progressive system known as “Jim Crow.“ Jim Crow’s features included segregated accommodations, segregated and underfunded schools for Good Negroes, rendered it virtually impossible for Good or Bad Negroes to vote, and of course prevented them from changing jobs without the permission of their employer. Thus, the Good Negro was gradually prepared for eventual emancipation.
Sure, there was the occasional need to (understandably) preserve order by lynching a Bad Negro, but by and large Jim Crow moved the Good Negroes about three inches toward freedom in 90 short years.
Then, Martin Luther King, SNCC, and outside agitators from the north who just didn’t understand stirred up the Good Negroes, who had never previously given so much as a thought to Civil Rights. Worse luck, television showed the beatings and hosings and police dogs to northern homes that just didn’t understand about the south and how important these things were to the eventual freedom of the Good Negroes. Then that turncoat LBJ stuck his big ears in the picture and, well, the WPSI was finally over except that the W part of it lives still.
All hail Lady Virtus!
These Lew Rockwell types have a deep seated hatred for President Lincoln. They will always refer to him as Mr. Lincoln. And their logic is simply short of miraculous as they weave and twist it to a conclusion; one that they approve of.
ReplyDeleteThe first time I came across their website I was shocked at what I read. These folks need help!